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kim-0610
11 Posts |
 Posted - 08/05/2012 : 15:22:07
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Hi,
Im not a tech or a contractor. I own a gas station in Ontario canada.
Recently(started in May), my dispensers would shut down(power lose) and starts to reboot once people finish their fill up or when they lift a nozzle. It doesnt happen when a fuel is being dispensed. Only after any nozzles are lifted or placed back.
It happens nearly 3 times these days, seems like its happening more frequently now.
No power breaker falling or power failure to another equipments. Basically, pumps themseleves turn off and turn back on right away.
This could happen more than 3 times a day depends how busy the station gets. Because more people do lift and place back the nozzles.
My site has all gilbarco encore series pumps(3years old)+ gilbarco passport+FE stp-cbs control boxes for each unleaded, unleaded premium and diesel + FE petro company products( incon box, relay box).
-I assumed a box which controls the camera was causing this issue, so installed the newbox. The problem didnt go away.
-Did diagnostics on all pumps and they were in a good condition.
-All breakers are okay, no falling one.
-all wires seems tight and attached where they ahould be.
-detected some burnt stains inside the FE STP-CBS boxes, both unleaded and unleaded premium, so changed the new box.
-NO error, alarm, or warning messeages are shown on the Incon box.
I do not know when the shut off would happen, it was all of sudden,but I know it may happen when the nozzles are lifted or placed back.
My last guess will be to have a service tech for FE systems to come down and do check ups for everything.
But I donot want to waste money on fixing nothing.
Can you guys give me an idea where this problem is starting?
I know a light on the STP-CBS control box turns on when a nozzle is lifted and a light turns off when the nozzles is down. Since it only happens during nozzles been placed back, could these STP boxes be a problem?
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jingwak
192 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 16:18:58
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If the dispensers are 3 years old they are Encore 500 series, which means they have stored error logs (fault memory). So, you need to have a Gilbarco technician come out and start to look into this, likely by puling the logs from the affected dispensers. You should also be trying to duplicate this on your own during a less busy time at your store with two or more people's help by starting up more than one pump and trying to make the pumps re-boot. Find out the exact situation where this fails and pass it along to the tech.
It could be any number of problems causing this. If you can duplicate the failure be sure to also duplicate it when the pumps are in stand alone mode, thereby eleminating the Point of Sale as a cause. A qualified Gilbarco tech should know how to tract down the problem and if he can't he can call Gilbarco on your behalf and come to a solution.
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 16:42:21
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quote:
Originally posted by jingwak
If the dispensers are 3 years old they are Encore 500 series, which means they have stored error logs (fault memory). So, you need to have a Gilbarco technician come out and start to look into this, likely by puling the logs from the affected dispensers. You should also be trying to duplicate this on your own during a less busy time at your store with two or more people's help by starting up more than one pump and trying to make the pumps re-boot. Find out the exact situation where this fails and pass it along to the tech.
It could be any number of problems causing this. If you can duplicate the failure be sure to also duplicate it when the pumps are in stand alone mode, thereby eleminating the Point of Sale as a cause. A qualified Gilbarco tech should know how to tract down the problem and if he can't he can call Gilbarco on your behalf and come to a solution.
Here is how or when failure happens
-a nozzle being lifted for dispensing, it could be on any pumps
-a customer stops at desire amounts, place nozzle back.
-ALL dispensers go off and reboot (not only the pump that was being used)
So im curious, lets say one pump is holding the maximum error logs, can it triggers all pumps to go out at the same?
Also no power failure to pumps when they are in a stand mode....
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POSDiddy
USA
610 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 17:13:36
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| We could speculate, but ultimately - you need a tech. If you want speculation, then my .02 is someone should see if you have a tank monitor looking for dispenser switch signals, a bad switch and relays set to trip under certain leak conditions. (If you dont see a handle switch then fuel leaving would be perceived as a leak until some condition clears it...) |
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 18:10:01
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quote:
Originally posted by POSDiddy
We could speculate, but ultimately - you need a tech. If you want speculation, then my .02 is someone should see if you have a tank monitor looking for dispenser switch signals, a bad switch and relays set to trip under certain leak conditions. (If you dont see a handle switch then fuel leaving would be perceived as a leak until some condition clears it...)
Sorry, im not clearing getting your states.
What do you mean .02? Some kinda code?
I have a FE incon tank monitoring system. Funny thing is it not showing any warnings or errors, looks fine. Though, should I call a technician to have him check? |
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POSDiddy
USA
610 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 19:03:14
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| My .02 cents, my input, my thoughts.... nevermind. Call your local service provider. |
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jingwak
192 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 19:18:20
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| I also say call a tech, but if you know how to put your pumps into stand alone mode and this problem doesn't happen in stand alone and only in console mode, then it is likely related to the Passport. Perhaps something is not programmed correctly in the forecourt setup of the Passport. Call a tech. |
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helpless_tech
183 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 19:22:50
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Are the pumps actually LOSING power and physically rebooting?
Or do they just go offline at the console and then come back?
If the latter, I suspect a Passport/EDH problem. If the former, I doubt the POS is at fault. The POS doesn't have any control over the power supplied to the dispensers. |
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xardoz
USA
3485 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 20:03:33
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What do the card reader display while the "REBOOT" is happening?
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https://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security
will deserve neither and lose both.
Benjamin Franklin |
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 21:17:09
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quote:
Originally posted by helpless_tech
Are the pumps actually LOSING power and physically rebooting?
Or do they just go offline at the console and then come back?
If the latter, I suspect a Passport/EDH problem. If the former, I doubt the POS is at fault. The POS doesn't have any control over the power supplied to the dispensers.
They actually lose power, and physically reboot, takes about 3~5mins for pumps to initialize again.
Just to sum up before I call tech tomorrow, do you guys think this is somehow related to an electric promblem? or pumps/the fuel monitoring system/passport problem.
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 21:18:22
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quote:
Originally posted by xardoz
What do the card reader display while the "REBOOT" is happening?
on the EMV screen, it displays a rebooting process...or initializing process |
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xardoz
USA
3485 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 22:00:26
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I am sorry to be picky, but card reader (DCR/CRIND) Displays display some concrete!
Not, something like......
What exactly is displayed!
And what is an: EMV screen
Vague responses cause techs to get pissy or wrong diagnose to be given! |
https://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201
Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security
will deserve neither and lose both.
Benjamin Franklin |
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2012 : 22:56:34
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quote:
Originally posted by xardoz
I am sorry to be picky, but card reader (DCR/CRIND) Displays display some concrete!
Not, something like......
What exactly is displayed!
And what is an: EMV screen
Vague responses cause techs to get pissy or wrong diagnose to be given!
cant really describe how the display looks something like...
step.1 packing......ok
step.2 packing......ok
step.3 pakcing......ok
and it so goes on till step7. and the screen initialzies.
but thats what i have seen all the time for long time ago (whenever I had to restart the dispenser for some reason) when I didnt suffer this shut downs...
yes I dont want to see my tech to become pissy, so I need to at least know little bit about where the issue has been started..
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bigbadjohn
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2012 : 05:30:56
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That screen is part of the normal boot up process for EMV CRIND (completely different animal than anything Gilbarco uses in the US). Your CRIND's are definitely rebooting. The question is are they losing power or is this a firmware re-boot? What firmware are your CRIND's running, and did this problem start with a software upgrade at the Passport. I'd guess that with Passport you're an Esso site, and IOL were pushing a patch in late May? How many dispensers do you have and how many pump loops feeding the Passport? There were issues with load balancing the CRINDs on the loops (a bit of a red herring IMO, but it's something to look at)
Make sure the CRIND firmware is at the latest and greatest (currently 50.1.12). Check the date and time in all the CRIND's, and make sure each has a unique IP address, IP should be ignored if you're using 2-wire communication but they don't seem to play well if the IP's aren't different. Have Gilbarco dial in and check your EDH. If there's no resolution have the technician tag, label and bypass any devices that control the head power, if it doesn't happen with the power bypassed you know it's POS related. |
Don't learn safety by accident.
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2012 : 10:28:36
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbadjohn
That screen is part of the normal boot up process for EMV CRIND (completely different animal than anything Gilbarco uses in the US). Your CRIND's are definitely rebooting. The question is are they losing power or is this a firmware re-boot? What firmware are your CRIND's running, and did this problem start with a software upgrade at the Passport. I'd guess that with Passport you're an Esso site, and IOL were pushing a patch in late May? How many dispensers do you have and how many pump loops feeding the Passport? There were issues with load balancing the CRINDs on the loops (a bit of a red herring IMO, but it's something to look at)
Make sure the CRIND firmware is at the latest and greatest (currently 50.1.12). Check the date and time in all the CRIND's, and make sure each has a unique IP address, IP should be ignored if you're using 2-wire communication but they don't seem to play well if the IP's aren't different. Have Gilbarco dial in and check your EDH. If there's no resolution have the technician tag, label and bypass any devices that control the head power, if it doesn't happen with the power bypassed you know it's POS related.
Thanks for your advice.
I have 4 dispensers and 8 pumps looped.
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kim-0610
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2012 : 11:52:49
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quote:
Originally posted by kim-0610
quote:
Originally posted by bigbadjohn
That screen is part of the normal boot up process for EMV CRIND (completely different animal than anything Gilbarco uses in the US). Your CRIND's are definitely rebooting. The question is are they losing power or is this a firmware re-boot? What firmware are your CRIND's running, and did this problem start with a software upgrade at the Passport. I'd guess that with Passport you're an Esso site, and IOL were pushing a patch in late May? How many dispensers do you have and how many pump loops feeding the Passport? There were issues with load balancing the CRINDs on the loops (a bit of a red herring IMO, but it's something to look at)
Make sure the CRIND firmware is at the latest and greatest (currently 50.1.12). Check the date and time in all the CRIND's, and make sure each has a unique IP address, IP should be ignored if you're using 2-wire communication but they don't seem to play well if the IP's aren't different. Have Gilbarco dial in and check your EDH. If there's no resolution have the technician tag, label and bypass any devices that control the head power, if it doesn't happen with the power bypassed you know it's POS related.
Thanks for your advice.
I have 4 dispensers and 8 pumps looped.
Called Gilbarco, checked the EDH and also did check the software of crinds, found they are up to dates. |
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